FORGET ABOUT RUSSIAN ELECTION HACKING, THERE’S VOTER DATA FOR ...

Ok, I confess, I'm just not all that excited about the allegations of Russia hacking American elections. I'm one of those neanderthals - as I pointed out yesterday in the completely different context of high frequency algorithmic trading - who likes the old-fashioned, humanly connected activity of paper: paper books, not amendable ebooks, paper stock certificates or bonds or other securities, and, yea, paper ballots. My disgust with the election system began, not with allegations of the always-byzantine-never-to-be-trusted-Russians in cahoots with the always-flambouyant-never-to-be-taken-seriously-Mr. Trump, but with a scandal with voting machines itself, first brought to Americans' attentions in a book by the Collier brothers back in the early 1990s, called Votescam, all about using election machines to rig elections, right here at home, no Russians needed. Of course, since the Russian hacking meme broke, there have also been contests reported to see who can hack into a voting machine system the fastest. Surprise surprise, it only took mere minutes.  As far as I'm concerned, I am as much worried about the indications of election fraud committed by both political parties in this country, as about anything the Russians may have allegedly been up to.

With that said, Mr. T.M. found yet another curious article this week concerning voter fraud, or rather, sale of data from voting machines:

Personal Info of 650,000 Voters Discovered on Poll Machine Sold on Ebay

What caught my eye was the fact that Kevin Collier, one of the two brothers who originally wrote Votescam, is the author of this article, and he zeros in on that contest:

When 650 thousand Tennesseans voted in the Memphis area, they probably didn’t expect their personal information would eventually be picked apart at a hacker conference at Caesars Palace Las Vegas.

And that isn't the end of it:

Election Systems and Software (ES&S), which makes the ExpressPoll-5000, is one of the most popular e-poll book manufacturers in the country, said Barbara Simons, who sits on the board of Verified Voting, a nonpartisan research group that advocates for voting-machine security. There’s no formal auditing process for how many of the machines are properly wiped, and thus no way to estimate how many machines have been sold that inadvertently contain voter records.

But the fact that only a handful of such machines were made available at DEF CON and one of them had personal records that were so easily available doesn’t inspire confidence, said Matt Blaze, a renowned security researcher who has authored several studies on voting machine security and who helped organize the village.

“How many other of these machines that also have data left on them have been sold to who knows who? There’s no way of knowing,” Blaze told Gizmodo.

After being sold at government auction, many machines are later resold, often for a few hundred dollars. Harri Hursti, a voting machine expert who famously found a critical flaw in Diebold voting systems, helped coordinate the machines’ purchase for the conference by scouring eBay. The one seller he visited in person before buying had filled an entire warehouse with voting machines bought at auction, he said.

Anyone with access to such a device—whether on Election Day or while playing with an ExpressPoll-5000 at home—would need only moderate computer skills to check for those records. (Emphasis added)

Stop and let that one sink in for a moment: there is "no formal auditing process for how many of the machines are properly wiped, and thus no way to estimate how many machines have been sold that inadvertently contain voter records."  That said, in today's climate (note, I said climate, not culture, for the political class has none of the latter) of rampant corruption, and the "double standard" that laws made by legislators are for everyone but themselves, one can bet one's bottom dollar that voter records have been illicitly sold.

Not only that, argues Collier, but there are much greater opportunities for fraud than meets the eye:

The privacy breach, however, isn’t the full extent of problems with the ExpressPoll-5000. Even though the device doesn’t tally actual vote results, and instead simply registers voters at a polling place, a compromised machine’s lack of security could be used to disenfranchise tens or hundreds of thousands of voters on voting day.

Electronic poll books are often simply given to election officials for safekeeping. There’s no comprehensive look at how effectively those officials keep their machines, but some store them at home, and it’s clear that they’re not always kept secure. In April, before the runoff vote in Georgia’s special congressional election, a thief stole four e-poll books from the pickup truck of a poll manager while he shopped for groceries.

If someone were to covertly access the memory card before the election, they could mark some or all users as having already voted absentee, preventing them from casting their actual vote. “I could write a script to do that in seconds,” Palmer said.
If that sounds unlikely, only recall those allegations of voter fraud occurring in Nuttyfornia during the last election. I recall a youtube video made by one lady who acted as a polling officer in one precinct in that state, stating that people were showing up in droves at her polling place, only to be turned away. The explanation? Their "records" showed the people had already voted by absentee ballot(https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qFoRQYnI1bo). And of course, we all know what happened to Senator Sanders in Nuttyfornia.
The solution? I'm bold to suggest that it lies in stopping the government money trough to the voting machine companies(conflict of interest, anyone?), restoration of paper ballots, and, yes, the restoration of counting teams with carefully spelled out oversight procedures. Certainly ballot boxes can be stuffed, as evidenced by Lyndon Johnson's "miraculous" victory in his 1948 senate election, or as evidenced by John F Kennedy's "win" in Cook County (Chicago) in 1960. But I would aver that the risks are far higher to would-be fraudsters under such circumstances than they are with easy to hack machines, a corrupt political culture, and two halves of the same political party hell bent on the preservation of their privilege and power. And that way, if the Russians want to hack our elections, they'll have to come here and physically stuff the ballot boxes.
See you on the flip side...

42 thoughts on “ FORGET ABOUT RUSSIAN ELECTION HACKING, THERE’S VOTER DATA FOR ...”

  1. NO proof whatsoever that Russian govt. or Russians hacked U.S. e-voting machines or e-voting computer tabulators. However, others may have done this.

    What DID happen is that the Russian Kosher Nostra and U.S. & Israeli Kosher Nostra guys “skewed” election perceptions with “fake news” about Hillary from Macedonian & other robo-troll centers AND that U.S. intel agencies have a RAW data pass-thru deal with Bibi’s boys, who passed the DNC & Podesta emails to WikiLeaks for later release (“salted” & enhanced by Bibi’s boys). DNC & Podesta won’t talk about this — to U.S. intel veterans (i.e., VeteransToday.com) or others.

    Mueller is now focused on Trump’s money laundering for the Russian Kosher Nostra and recently executed a pre-dawn, mafia-like raid on Manafort. For info on Trump’s Kosher Nostra connections & money laundering, see “Trump’s Russian Laundromat” at https://newrepublic.com/article/143586/trumps-russian-laundromat-trump-tower-luxury-high-rises-dirty-money-international-crime-syndicate (“How to use Trump Tower and other luxury high-rises to clean dirty money, run an international crime syndicate, and propel a failed real estate developer into the White House”). However, VT had it first.

    Dummycrook Hillary & DNC rigged California+ against Bernie in the old fashioned way. Trump’s Kosher Nostra election Ops were MUCH more sophisticated.

    Except for Russian Kosher Nostra money laundering Ops thru Trump, a post-bankruptcy Trump would NEVER be the Republithug nominee — much less win.

    Trump was/is the less competent of two evils — easier to dump. “Dump Trump!”

    1. If Trump ‘screws the pooch’ enough on his puerile, power-drunk, pissing contest with Kim, then both Republithugs & Dummycrooks will Impeach & Remove Trump — maybe starting with a quick 25th Amendment removal (‘cuz Trump is incapable).

      Fortunately, Hillary would NOT become Prez. Maybe not Pence either, because Congress critters have been meeting at the Metropolitan Club in Washington DC to discuss Nixon/Agnew-like resignations and/or removals.

  2. Hey Lost, are you attempting to be cantankerous? Or – are you truly lost in the dark writing pointless comments concerning voter fraud?

    Here’s a college kid the Dummycrats paid in Virginia bolster their voting list. The twit is going to the klink registering dead voters.

    http://www.dcclothesline.com/2017/08/11/college-student-gets-100-days-in-jail-for-registering-dead-voters-as-democrats/

    How is it possible you claim “zero evidence” concerning the fraud in CA your mindless post? Pax Vobiscum.

    “Los Angeles County officials ‘informed us that the total number of registered voters [in the County] now stands at a number that is a whopping 144% of the total number of resident citizens of voting age.’”
    FAR MORE REGISTERED VOTERS THAN THE TOTAL NUMBER OF PEOPLE WHO ARE OF VOTING AGE.
    That’s doesn’t work. That’s fraud.
    http://www.dcclothesline.com/2017/08/09/california-vote-scandal-blows-up/

    If you ever read the Federal Election Reports, you would know Obummer stole both elections according to FEC’s own documents that revealed (2008 and 2012) there were 35+ million additional votes ABOVE the 90+ million registered voters.

    There is no difference whatsoever in the parties, Democrats and Republicans as they’re owned by the same syndicate when it comes to voting in their private corporate foreign elections and merely take turns screwing the people. FDR’s 1933 bankruptcy finally settled 1998 and Clinton failed to return the people’s land and assets held as surety then Obummer bankrupts UNITED STATES and the United States of America, Inc., which in turn bankrupted the corporate governments worldwide.

    By there deeds you will know them. Who is for globalization and who is against it.

    1. Phil,

      So no evidence of voter fraud in California’s 2016 general election. That’s what you were asked for.

      Also, there is no evidence that Obama stole either the 2008 or 2012 election. McCain was a vastly unpopular candidate, from the party of an even more unpopular president who’d had two elections stolen for him. Both W thefts there’s ample evidence for, the first is broadly accepted fact.

      You’re insistence that Obama stole his election borders on ugly forms of xenophobia. Like it or not Obama could rally the vote. Romney not so much, nor Hillary in 2016.

      As for your claims about registered voters in L.A. County California, you’ll have to first triple check your sources, and then learn the difference between registration and voting.

      Obama was a popular politician, Palin cost McCain votes, Hillary/Kaine not popular, Trump more energetic than Hillary and a difference face, he still didn’t win the popular vote because of his ugly rhetoric–it especially cost him in California.

      Like Hillary, Trump is pro-big business and much of globalization, which is another word for gifts to the deal makers not the makers.

      1. Phil the Thrill

        I never insisted Obama stole anything, yet you say I did so, and you further imply that this is a form of xenophobia– fear of something strange and/or foreign. Are you saying Mr. Obama is strange and/or foreign? I will concede that he prefers white men for intimate partnership, but I will leave it to you, Lost, to explain how Mr. Obama is strange and/or foreign.

        1. @Phil

          “I will concede that he [Obama] prefers white men for intimate partnership, but I will leave it to you,”

          You know this how?

          Oh, and Obama’s strange, to many in the USA, because his dad was from Africa, and went back there. Then there’s Obama’s teen years in Indonesia.

  3. Phil the Thrill

    1) I did not claim Reid was currently in the Senate. 2) That the Reid family awarded the SEIU the contract to service the electronic voting machines in Nevada is well documented, as are the polls which consistently pitted him well behind his opponents before his “miraculous” last-minute victories, the number of votes counted in many cases being greater than the number of registered voters, various legal challenges in Nevada seeking to verify the votes being tossed out of court, etc. One may visit the usual websites to see the archived evidence…before giggle memory-holes, throttles, or otherwise scrubs it. 3) The facts regarding Nuttyfornia’s motor-voter “law” are as I clearly explained, and I should know, since I live here.
    4) We are not claiming that individual voters somehow commit fraud, but that the current system of electronic vote tabulation is hopelessly fraudulent (recall the numerous videos of people touching the screen for Trump, yet the screen selecting Clinton, for just one example). 5) I was not attempting to accurately quote you; rather, I accurately summed up your argument, so that others could admire it without the clutter of excess verbiage.
    Let’s cut to the chase, Lost. There is no defending this current federal government, which does business as a privately owned, for-profit corporation. The fact that Jeff Sessions’ DOJ is currently obstructing access to Clinton’s Benghazi emails regarding Benghazi is just one grain of sand’s worth of evidence, in a whole Sahara desert’s worth, that the fed gub exists solely to generate profit for its shareholders.

    1. Phil the Thrill

      Oh, hey, sorry about the placement of the above comment! It’s supposed to be all the way down at the bottom, in reply to “Lost”. My bad.

    2. So you have conjecture about Reid, but no solid evidence, say for example exit polls at big variances on the day of election, or crashing vote counting servers on election night.

      It would be interesting to see videos of computer voting machines in California visually switching from Trump to Hillary. I posit it’s unlikely that you can provide them–not impossible. And you’d still have to deal with the fact that California 2016 was going for Hillary so there’s no reason to have stolen it.

      Also, and I don’t know how prevalent touch screen voting is in California, you raise a point that I’m not sure you want to make, the way computers work the switch that says record the text “Hillary” can visually display that, but in fact record “Trump” or record nothing, or some meaningless term.

      You’re going to have to do much better. You’re above inventions regards Obama tell me you’re not interested in voter fraud, or uncounted votes, you’re interested in the end you want.

      Hillary lost the 2016 election fairly, there was no Russian hacking of anything to do with the election, people in 6 six states, that Obama had won twice, voted for Trump. Hillary was warned many times that she was a weak candidate, and she knew that the electoral votes of places like CA and NY and MA were going to her. She was also lazy, and cheap, Trump was not.

      1. Phil the Thrill

        I’m going to have to do much better? No, I am not. Nobody is paying me to do this, so I can do it however I want. I certainly can’t say the same for every other poster here.

        1. Phil:

          “I certainly can’t say the same for every other poster here.”

          Ah yes, those who object to your “evidence” must be paid by Obama.

  4. I believe we are eventually going to have to have a Consti tutional Amendment forced-through, which puts the nation back on a verifiable vote tabulation. Personally, as I have said earlier here, I would ditch anything electronic (see “Battlestar Galactica” Mk2 as to why: hackable) and legislate paper-only with verification by three-person groups (mandatory: a democrat, a republican, and an independent) all the way up to national collation. We have to take our Nation back…

    Ultimately, this comes down to Verification of Intent. Stepping into SF for a moment, there are at least two SF franchises that were wiped-off the public stage, while being wildly popular to their audiences. One was the TV series “Babylon 5.” The other was a book series called “Lensman” by E.E. ‘Doc’ Smith…

    In the “Lensman” universe, a society remarkably like ours was plagued by the lack of being able to identify who was Really a good-guy versus who was Really a bad-guy. Sound familiar? Anything the good-guys could come-up-with for Verification of good-guy status was soon corrupted or counterfeited by the bad-guys. Sound familiar? Basically, the baddies could swim-within the ‘tainted’ society, doing as they wished. Sound familiar?

    Well, a third-party stepped into the picture. A higher race. They ‘issued’ a Lens to various humans, after verifying their incorruptibility (including telepathic mind-probing). With the Lens coming from a higher culture, the bad-guys could not counterfeit it. (It also worked Only for the person ‘issued’ it.) It gave the good-guys something to rally around. The culture was reborn…

    I was always curious why this immensely-popular series was suppressed. I think I know WHY, now…

  5. Robert Barricklow

    A 2-Part dictatorship that selects incumbents; unless the incumbent wants to actually represent the people.
    The executive, legislative and judicial are nonexistent; in that they do not enforce the law as it stands, nor even pretend to.
    The laws are there, including election laws. But whose enforcing them?
    The administration just appoints judges, etc., who don’t practice law. They, the elites, are looting the system.
    Yeltsins by the score, selling out. The system is being usurped into a wholesale rentier’s monopoly.
    The public slowly squeezed out of existence.
    Then they begin eating their own

    1. Robert Barricklow

      The legislature corrects past legislation that would put oligarchs in jail; legalizing crimes – ex post facto!

      1. Robert Barricklow

        Poor Michael Collins who was on his way to blowing the whistle/subpoenaed on elections, flying his small plane, he was taken out[EMP]like the Wellstones before & after him.
        Bushes Brain[Karl Rove’s EEG] soon after, normalized.

  6. Since the USSA corrupts elections around the world just ask how corrupt they are on native reservations. Voter machine fraud is just part of credit-debit card stock market scams that infest this society. Ballot boxes can be stuff but it’s a piece of cake to fix a dumb voter machine and since when have our overlords ever believe in honest elections anyway.

  7. I remember the 2000 presidential election pretty well. My wife and I lived in Florida in ground zero for that election. There was much written in the newspapers and in local television broadcasts warning everyone voting that the ballots changed, but the hysteria that erupted within days after the election was truly pathetic. That that ballot was prominently featured in newspapers and news broadcasts in neighborhoods affected to warn the public of the change was never mentioned nationally. It was a crisis of opportunity to replace a reasonable, electronic alternative to paper ballots with a fully electronic one where elections can be stolen with transparent ease. Now that hacking is the meme to destroy that confidence, the Deep State is projecting its own activities onto other villains to achieve yet another goal. I believe the Deep State wants two things:

    1. To force everyone to vote via Internet so that election results can be tabulated in real time.
    2. To tie each individual vote back to a person’s electronic identity so it can be linked to their remaining electronic information inventory.

    Once they know who votes and how they voted they now have the perfect political polling tool for a whole new set of social engineering research projects yielding new tactics and strategies. From their point of view, democracy works optimally when the governed understand their votes are open and known to the remainder of the public. This way the thought police can better leverage the masses and use massive peer pressure to force everyone down their planned, optimal path of governance.

    1. I was watching the 2000 presidential election pretty closely. At one point, Dan Rather ‘called’ Florida for Gore, based on polling results of voters. Some time later, Rather came on the air and announced that he had been mistaken – Bush had taken Florida. Rather blurted out – on air – that he had NEVER seen such a huge discrepancy between polling results and ‘official’ voting results. He was truly confused and embarrassed. That was when I knew the fish was smelling in Denmark…

      (On your real-time identification of voters, I am reminded of one of the Matt Damon “Bourne” movies. In this one, they showed an overview of the alphabet-agency ‘command center’ for an op. What was interesting was how they had software & databases which could ‘access’ a random person’s web of interactions. They could – real time – pull-up who this random person had contacted (or vice versa) in the past, A web of association. And act upon these ‘clues’, instantly. I think we got a glimpse into the Real ‘domestic’ intel world with this movie…)

      1. And in reality of course Gore won Florida in 2000. Though not by the margins Rather assumed.

        Yeah, those exit polls Rather was citing say votes weren’t being counted.

        See Ohio 2004.

        1. Robert Barricklow

          The Supreme Court committed treason
          by not counting Florida’s vote.
          My friend commissioned a t-shirt
          of those 5 justices.
          w/their mug shots
          under the caption,
          Wanted for Treason.

      2. Oh, yes, goshawks. I remember the Rather debacle rather well. The prevailing wisdom at the time was to assume statistical turnout for the panhandle region in favor of Gore–which proved to be unfounded. Hanging chads and clamors for fraud were all over the state–coming from both Democratic and Republican precincts. It was a mess for sure! It didn’t help that Gore’s name was shifted from its traditional position on the ballot, replaced by Buchanan’s name, for ballots using the electronic voting machines in much of South Florida. This is actually a critical clue that throws everything into a cocked hat. There would have been no point in a do-over without including every state in the union, so the 2000 election will always be a questionable victory for Bush. Having witnessed a lot of it personally, I’m not even sure he won.

        Lost, there were over nine independent investigations of election fraud in the State of Florida during that time. At one time I had traced them all down. Each one concluded, based on the evidence at the time, that Bush was further ahead in some Democratic strongholds than originally predicted whereas the Buchanan margin was much higher than expected. Gore’s totals were off by a larger margin than anticipated. The whole point behind the clamor was THE CLAIM that people voted for Buchanan by mistake! I saw for myself people walking into the poll booths, filling out their cards in breakneck speed and inserting them into the voting machines without READING the ballot, so I’m convinced these claims may have been true. The relocation of Gore’s name on the ballot explains the discrepancy between the raw vote totals and the exit polls and the observed differentials between the Buchanan and Gore vote totals. That change was very much publicized in newspapers and news broadcasts, but these were completely ignored. If the question was, should Gore have won the election in Florida if people were cautious with their vote? I would say, “yes.” If the question was, was there vote fraud in Florida in 2000? I would say, “yes and by both parties. There were precincts in Miami that were notorious for their vote fraud activities.” If the question was, did Bush win the raw vote as tallied by the precincts in Florida? I would say, “I don’t know. He was credited with the win, but I am not sure. I believe he may have won, but I did not see any proof the last time I looked. That was years ago. The most decisive argument for a Gore victory was not a challenge in Florida. He should have challenged Ohio and Tennessee.”

        Now, Lost, the real problem NO ONE talks about is the vote fraud in Tennessee. Why Al Gore did NOT challenge Tennessee is beyond me. He lost his home state! There were enough electoral college votes in Tennessee to give him the election, but a challenge in Tennessee would not give him the margin he wanted. I remember listening to voter analysts on the Jeff Rense show from archives back in that time who strongly suggested that Tennessee’s votes were tampered with in favor of Bush–particularly in the Chattanooga area. The Gore campaign gambled on Florida because of it’s size of it’s electoral college vote–not his ability to win the challenge. He took only one shot at the challenge whereas he should have followed a different strategy. Either Gore either let his pride get in the way, AND/OR he may have been cautioned to not protest too loudly and accept the outcome. Now that I am older and wiser, I suspect the Deep State told him to back down. I believe they were into planning events for the following year and picked Bush as their man. The Bush brothers were the modern equivalent to the Dulles brothers–only one of them was not as bright.

        1. OC, I think as$ume and an@lysts got you in the holding bin. I now ‘spell’ them as ana lysts and as sume to get through. Also, I have been modded for any word which includes ‘t1t’ within it – Consti tution, ti tle, etc. I have to do an extra ‘screening’ pass, and still don’t catch some. Stupid…

          (And thanks for much detailed info that I did not know. I am glad I checked-back, otherwise I’d never have seen it. That is why I leave a ‘unmodded’ notice on the latest page, with a URL back.)

          1. Robert Barricklow

            Goshawks.
            Looks like
            brea king up with our far ci cal moder a tor is not as hard to do
            as the song implies.
            From now on my
            ex s10 u ated replies
            will be brea king up.

            Copy?
            Good bye mod er a tor.
            As the saying goes
            that’s a
            t it s up solu tion.

      3. Goshawks and Lost, I penned a response to both. Unfortunately, it’s in the quantum state of moderation AGAIN! (Was it something I said, or is it me?) You may want to check back for my observations if there is an interest.

  8. Voting procedures in Italy. Towns keep a list of poll station personnel which any resident voter can sign for. The President of each “section” – there are one or more sections per station according to the population – must hold a PhD degree. Then there is a secretary and 4 scrutineers. They all get a small reimbursement from the government for the trouble of staying at the station (short breaks allowed) from 6 am til all counting operations are completed (can be early next morning). Employees get paid leave from work, the self-employed zilch. When elections are called the people on the list are contacted but many opt out. Ballots are paper and are counted and re-counted before and after voting operations. Sounds simple but discrepancies, usually small, somehow do occur.
    There was a famous 1980s movie on how the vote could be rigged with just one blank ballot smuggled out of the station, setting up a “circular” movement so that almost everybody voted the same way. Other common frauds involve marking votes on blank ballots and sustaining that “unwanted” ballots are declared invalid because of an alleged out-of-place mark (a “sign of recognition” on a ballot will invalidate it).

    1. But fraud needs to have all the local HUMAN components either complicit or negligent, which is not easy. Because the candidates can send a representative to the stations to check polling and counting (as you can image these places get pretty crowded). So conflicting interests usually cancel out the worst fraud, at least at the LOCAL level. The paperwork showing local results then goes on to the city hall and after to the provincial and central level for computerised collating. Just what goes on there is anybody’s guess.

  9. They werent encrypted in order to allow easy access. If they needed easy access, it would have been to change data, as and when required..
    Makes me think of the ‘petit scandal’ around the presidential campaign, when it became known, that Soros owned the company who was making the polling stations.. And how his name was pulled from their websites1 or 2 days later.. anyone else remember that?

    1. K:

      The Soros trope is a dangerous meme to push, it puts you in really bad company.

      Also US voting is not all done by one type of machine or balloting process, it looks like you’re just reposting something you’d like to believe.

      1. Phil the Thrill

        “Pushing the Soros meme” puts K in the company of….Vladimir Putin! And also in the company of….Dr. Joseph Farrell! I don’t think it is a mere “meme” that the Russian Federation has declared Soros to be an enemy of the State, and subject to arrest, should he ever put even one of his dainty Hungarian toes on Russian soil.

  10. Ah, and what about those tens of thousands of non-valid “registered voters” in California? Are they “immigrants” who materially signed up to vote, or are they just bytes in a database? Who will investigate this travesty of democracy in the United States Corporation? A UN delegation headed by a Ukrainian or a Saudi? Or perhaps one of Mr. Soros’ democracy-loving foundations….

    1. There is basically no evidence for voting fraud. Hillary Clinton won California by millions of votes in Nov. 2016.

      What there is evidence for is bad vote counting, or not counting votes at all. The 2016 California Democratic Primary would be an example of the latter–the results were never fully counted.

      Now, right elections can be stolen by altering the vote count–this how Ohio was stolen in 2004 for W Bush. It also looks like Mitt Romney was expecting Ohio and Virginia to be stolen for him on election night 2012. (Though evidence for this is much less solid than the Ohio 2004 evidence.)

      1. Phil the Thrill

        Au contrere, mon frere. Harry Reid’s presence in the Senate is just one of numerous case studies in voter fraud; goggle has yet to scrub the evidence from the ‘net. The California motor-voter “law” is government-sanctioned vote fraud, as the law provides for non-US citizens to be registered to vote when they receive driver licenses, and the same law precludes/prevents any verification process to establish the voter eligibility of these drivers.
        We are always entertained by your presence here, Lost. “There’s no vote fraud, only bad counting.” Precious.

          1. Phil makes no sense, there’s no reason to steal California for Hillary, she was going to have a big win there any how.

            There is zero evidence for in person voting fraud, there’s evidence for stolen elections, but not the 2016 presidential races in any state.

        1. Phil:

          “The California motor-voter “law” is government-sanctioned vote fraud, as the law provides for non-US citizens to be registered to vote when they receive driver licenses, and the same law precludes/prevents any verification process to establish the voter eligibility of these drivers.”

          Do learn the difference between claiming something had a method of occurring and something occurred.

          Harry Reid is not in the Senate. If you have evidence he stole, or had stolen some previous election, feel free to share it, but if it is evidence akin to the California claims you made, you’ll be laughed at.

          “There’s no vote fraud, only bad counting.” You couldn’t even quote me accurately. Sad.

          And of course you don’t address the well documented theft of Ohio in Nov. 2004.

          1. Phil the Thrill

            Oops! Instead of my reply to you being here, I accidently submitted it as a stand-alone comment. It appears above.

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