Well now there is another fracture within the broad UFO community, this time within the so-called "exopolitics" community, between one of its principal exponents, Alfred Lambremont Webre, and Michael Salla.

Expolitics Founder Blocked when Exposing Flawed ET Research, Mars Gatekeeping

Although I've never been terribly interested in the field, I have to admit that my reaction to this piece of news is rather personal, and requires the telling of a personal anecdote.

While at a UFO conference in 2009, I met an exponent of "exopolitics" whose book booth happened to be right next to mine. I had, of course, been invited to speak about the historical and technological implications of the Nazi Bell project. As I was unpacking my books and laying them out for display, this individual asked me if it weren't possible for the Nazis to have - you guessed it - acquired all their technology from a crashed and recovered UFO and back-engineered it. The individual then went on to cite the alleged case of a crash in the Black Forest in 1933 (or the Harz Mountains in 1936...take your pick!), neither of which have much substantiation other than the usual spate of "witnesses" coming forth to tell their stories long after the events in question. One wonders why, within UFOlogy, such stories are accepted without much further investigation when they involve tails of crashed extraterrestrial debris, and are to be avoided like the plague when they are about hidden research that was conducted under the Nazi regime.

By this juncture, having been treated to this line of "non-argument" so many times that I was blue in the face (and usually from people that hadn't bothered to read any of my research, and who were only familiar with the usual Hannebu and Vril saucer nonsense so often alluded to by those who have "researched" the Nazi saucer story), I rather pointedly told this individual to do the research first, to exhaust all possibilities of historical and terrestrial rationalizations of the science, and then and only then to entertain notions of an ET influence on Nazi research.

I had then, rightly or wrongly, the impression that this individual wished very much either to "bring me on board" the exopolitics bandwagon, and to render the whole Nazi story and all its vast implications for the field, "safe" once again, or to implant the "meme" of reverse engineering of the whole enterprise.

I wasn't buying then, and I'm not buying now, and the posted article only reinforces my impressions.

Posted in

Joseph P. Farrell

Joseph P. Farrell has a doctorate in patristics from the University of Oxford, and pursues research in physics, alternative history and science, and "strange stuff". His book The Giza DeathStar, for which the Giza Community is named, was published in the spring of 2002, and was his first venture into "alternative history and science".


  1. marcos anthony toledo on March 4, 2011 at 12:10 pm

    The idea we need extraterreatials to make flying,diving spacecraft is hogwash we are well capable of making them ourselves anyway are airplanes are gliders with moters and with what the Nazis were playing around with they were quite capable of building them thereselves and there was a American Thomas Townsend Brown who was working on the same thing from the nineteen twenties to sixities. It like the wolf and the tasmanian tiger they may look simular but are only very distantly related it would be a cast of convergence in either case. The finding of a crashed saucer would only have confrimed the Nazi development and only slightly aidded them by showing them want they were doing right and shown want they were doing wrong if that.

  2. Justina on January 31, 2011 at 3:18 am

    These links might be of interest to some here.

  3. Dashiell Cabasa on January 28, 2011 at 7:11 am

    Well there i am sitting with my son as he watches Sonic the Hedgehog and…one of the characters starts waxing on about how the power stones in the cartoon Sonic collects are originally something to do with the great Baylon etc etc I actually had Cosmic War’ open reading the part about the ‘tablets of destinies’ as this popped up…hilarious!

    Yep…Lucas and Clarke and Spielberg and co and…whoever knocks out the scripts for the hd edgehog lol sure seem to know …well…something


  4. Greg Parent on January 28, 2011 at 1:19 am

    For ‘Heaven’s Gate!’, did not Jacques Vallee dispose of such nonsense 30 years ago, 20 years ago, and again (when his books were re-released) 2 years ago. There is obviously no evolution in is this crowd! Even the ‘mirage men’ must be tired of playing their tricks on these folks–it’s just too easy!

    • Justina on January 28, 2011 at 1:29 am

      the presence of ultraterrestrials, which like C. S. Lewis’
      That Hideous Strength’s “macrobes” might be just
      another name for demons, as Keel speculates also,
      does not rule out any of the rest of this. There is plenty
      of reason to figure they have been players in human
      politics and whatnot for a long time.

    • Joseph P. Farrell on January 28, 2011 at 6:22 am

      Yup!!! I agree!

  5. Bill on January 26, 2011 at 5:20 am

    Plesiosaurs on Mars! Well, no. As an avid student of paleontology, plesiosaurs swam the oceans of earth until the end of the Cretaceous when that giant impactor slammed into the Yucatan with the energy of around a hundred million megatons. While I think that some of the near earth comets and asteroids stem from an exploded planet from a paleoancient interplanetary war, some of this stuff left over from much more ancient planetesimal origins I believe have been zooming around out in space as well. Just can’t condemn all of “mainstream” science; as Richard Hoagland has pointed out, I think most scientists are honest hardworking people and they do get a lot of things right. If anyone has recently been to Mars via some super-secret space program, the Mars they’d be walking around on will be largely a frozen dead world stock with ancient icy ruins containing detailed records and likely ENGINEERABLE hi-tech infrastructure!

  6. Justina on January 26, 2011 at 2:33 am

    About Nazis and crashed aliens, if you aren’t already working
    somewhat in the same sort of stuff that is suddenly made
    available to your, you are not going to be able to figure out
    how to back engineer anything.

    Even if that crashed saucer story is true, the Nazis would
    only have gotten a jump start, not a full start. They had to be
    already working on the same sort of stuff, or their finds would
    have left them scratching their heads. Maybe play with wires
    and switches, get it going again, and crash it again this time
    permanently, taking out half the research team and anyone
    trying to fly it.

    So while I am open minded about the Harz incident, I agree
    with Dr. Farrell that the Nazis were working independently
    of such input. It would have only sped things up for them,
    not started them from scratch. Perhaps, if the story was true,
    they would have been sped up enough, that they would have
    gotten their wonder weapons workable in time and won the
    war. (Unless you argue divine intervention to slow them down

    The propaganda value of such wild stories, would seem to be,
    to give hope to those laboring on rebuilding nazism on the
    ground with marches and so forth, perhaps pre set some to
    be easily recruited to go for such further experiments,
    whether any space events ever occurred or not, create a
    sense of awe in the readers and some sense of favoring
    the Nazi regime. (This is not inconsistent, however, with
    some abortive space trips being halfway done. Or even an
    actual base established. A base that maybe is dying from
    nasty conditions and is desperate to replace personnel
    with stupid idealists from Earth? Maybe the original bunch
    is getting old and needs, ah, spare parts? from younger

  7. Justina on January 26, 2011 at 2:23 am

    Good God, Martian Pleisiosaur. And this guy is credible because he has
    been to Mars several times. That in itself should cue you that he is not
    terribly credible. I haven’t listened to the whole set of 24 video files, but I
    am working on it. The teleportation issue raises questions in my mind,
    also, and a “Courtney” is mentioned who I think was part of the Remote
    Viewing thing but I might be wrong. I haven’t listened to the whole thing.

    Now, as for pleisiosaurs, those things are (note I said ARE not were,
    because of events detailed in
    I think this is the right one) water dwellers. They have been reported
    coming up on land and seizing sheep in Scotland, and two out of three
    men were eaten by one in some American location I think. So they
    are carnivorous and do go on land, BUT they LIVE IN AND NEAR
    WATER. Basiowhatsisname describes a very dusty situation.

    And he himself suggests it was a simulation. The whole even may
    have been, if not in his imagination, an astral or mental projection
    which, not ruling out interaction on site does mean that an
    incalculable amount of his experiences may have been hallucinatory
    or controlled simulations produced by the mind of another affecting
    him telepathically.

    The whole trip, or most of its contents, could have been exactly
    that, assuming he ever did anything but sit in a chair and ponder.
    Such a state of mind in itself may trip over a few facts, and there
    is enough known both from NASA and from deductions and
    reading between the lines, to put together a Martian scenario
    like this, without being there.

    I doubt CIA got there. More likely an NSA or NRO person
    perhaps embedded in the CIA for them. There are ways of
    excusing him, but that pleisiosaur? naaaaah.

    Ain’tchall glad you got a creationist on board here? If it weren’t
    for that I wouldn’t know enough details about the pleisiosaur.
    Sure they are known to be water dinos, but the reports of
    coming on land add to the picture. But they live near water
    not in deserts.

    • Joseph P. Farrell on January 26, 2011 at 3:35 am

      Totally agree with you Justina… the exopolitics crowd is just plain wacko bonkers nuts for the most part.

    • MQ on January 27, 2011 at 1:58 pm

      Yep. If in doubt, Occam’s Razor. For the guy who claims to have seen a Pleisiosaur–next time, bring a camera, would ya? Put some rocks in your pockets, *something* at least remotely tangible that could be verified.
      But yes, most of these folks appear to be squirrelly, and they get rather peeved when their “religion” get questioned.

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