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ZERO HEDGE: DID PUTIN INDICATE HE’D RELEASE CLASSIFIED CONTROL ...

Mr. K.L. who is a regular reader here, found this extremely interesting "take" on recent events, including the downing of MH 17 in the Ukraine's Donetsk region, and the inability of American officials to offer anything like substantive proof to their claims that it was Russian-backed separatists that fired the missile:

US State Department "Confident" MH17 "Mistakenly" Downed By Separatists, Finds No Direct Link To Russia

There's a fly in the "attack Russia ointment," as Zero Hedge makes abundantly clear, citing the Associated Press coverage of the story:

"Senior U.S. intelligence officials say they have no evidence of direct Russian government involvement in the shooting down of Malaysia Airlines Flight 17.

"They say the passenger jet was likely felled by an SA-11 surface-to-air missile fired by Russian-backed separatists in eastern Ukraine and that Russia 'created the conditions' for the downing by arming the separatists.

"The officials briefed reporters Tuesday under ground rules that their names not be used in discussing intelligence related to last week's air disaster, which killed 298 people.

"They said they did not know if any Russians were present at the missile launch, and they wouldn't say that the missile crew was trained in Russia.

" A senior official said the most likely explanation was the plane was shot down by mistake." (Emphases in the original)

Ok...so just Russia "created the conditions"? I think not. If Russia is to be held to blame for the incident simply by having "created the conditions," then surely the same must ultimately be even more applicable to the USA and the West's actions in fomenting the coup and creating the chaos in the first place, if indeed, even they are responsible, for recall my high octane speculation of a few days ago: neither the West, the Ukraine, nor Russia has anything to gain either by creating the incident, sponsoring proxies or cut-outs to create it, or even by "creating the conditions." But some independent rogue group might

This is not, however, our focus here. The real focus is on the zinger that occurs at the very end of the Zero Hedge article with these two salvos:

"So - to sum up - having told the world that they would release details surrounding intelligence about the MH17 disaster, US officials have pulled a 'trust us' moment... blamed the 'terrorists' and given themselves an out with Putin... all with absolutely no public proof whatsoever...

"Which leaves us with one question - What happened between The White House and Putin (and perhaps Merkel) that ended with this lowering the tone of the debate?" (Emphasis in the original)

What indeed? Granted, it's hard to pull off a "trust us" moment when trust in the US government internationally is at an all time low.

Recall, for a moment, that President Putin phoned President Obama almost immediately after the downing of MH17, so what Zero Hedge is asking is what, exactly, did Putin(and perhaps Merkel) really convey to the White House, and why the subtle backpedaling from Washington?

Well, if the disclosure of Victoria Nuland's "phone call" comments prior to the Kiev coup are any indicator, if the USS Donald Cook incident are any indicator, and if the extensive Russian corporate networked contacts with the West and the Ukraine are any indicator, then perhaps Mr. Putin is sitting atop a mound of his own "classified information and sources," and may have conveyed that he was willing to "share it," leaving the Republicans in the US Senate to pick up the ball with the "Russian Aggression Act of 2014." Perhaps Mr. Putin also gently reminded the West that Russia never did buy into the doctrine of Mutually Assured Destruction, and that for them, as for the late West German Chancellor Audenaur, nuclear weapons are "just another form of artillery."

And I'll bet, like Zero Hedge, that it was a conference call including Frau Merkel, present, perhaps, by Mr.  Putin's invitation, and perhaps even unannounced and unbeknownst to the other end of the call.

See you on the flip side...

 

 

44 thoughts on “ ZERO HEDGE: DID PUTIN INDICATE HE’D RELEASE CLASSIFIED CONTROL ...”

    1. Interesting enough, except high altitude anti-aircraft missiles also fragment at the time of explosion.

      And the maximum altitude of the Sukhoi 25 probably isn’t 33,000 feet.

      So it’s possible, but no where near confirmation of any such claims about another aircraft shooting the airliner down with a cannon.

      1. A quick internet search of the terms “Sukhoi 25 ceiling” seems to indicate that the plane has an unpressurized cockpit. And likely can’t fly higher than 23,000–it is unclear if this limitation is something about the engines, or body, or the fact of the unpressurized cockpit, which a separate oxygen supply could perhaps counter.

        Anyhow it looks like it would have been very hard for this plane to be flying at 33,000 feet. And this German pilot had no business posting his speculations without explaining exactly how this plane would be flying that high, and that means interviewing people who have infact operated the Sukhoi 25 at 35,000.

    2. There was an interesting discussion of the cockpit fuselage photos at this website: http://theaviationist.com/2014/07/24/mh-17-puncture-marks/

      Several commenters voiced the opinion that the damage looked like the result of shrapnel from an air to air missile. When the story first broke we were being told that everyone agreed it was a sam, so I was immediately suspicious. The counter argument was that the Sukhoi couldn’t operate at the cruising altitude of MH17. It doesn’t seem technically impossible to make the necessary modifications, but what if the plane was flying at a lower altitude? Love these Boeing 777s; with the remote control function, you never know who might be flying the plane.

      1. Anthroposophe:

        Regarding an hypothetical massive change in altitude by the Boeing, one would have to find evidence of such a change. And no party has cited any evidence like that.

        Now the possibility that a Sukhoi 25 carried a missile to the general vicinity of the Boeing is a speculation that the German pilot’s website did not engage in. The German pilot’s website insists on the small cannon of the SU25 doing the damage.

        So you’ve raised a perfectly interesting idea–an anti aircraft missile fired from below by a plane (SU25) not able to fly up to the Boeing. Seems possible, but it raises the question which missile and can that missile be fired and carried by the SU25?

        Looks to me like records of an SU25 flying in the area are a distraction or simply unrelated to the crash.

  1. The real question is has there been a putsch in the USA and when did it take place. Who really is in charge of our government and dishing out the orders to their mouth pieces in Washington DC. I ask this because what been going on of late is loony tunes stuff.

    1. It’s not new that the crazies are trying to run things. And limit reality to their views, not views based on science or reality.

      But how much they can be controlled or stopped varies with the decade.

      There seems to be some group of humans bent on a nihilistic (second law of thermodynamics)approach to running human affairs. So yes, even text book “science” can be used for this end.

      Usually it’s the arts that end up slipping something thru, and ironically in the last 20 years the internets, no matter how spied upon those networks be.

      Kennedy got killed.

      Johnson effectively resigned over Vietnam.

      Nixon my have engineered the resignation of himself to disrupt other things.

      Carter told the Israelis to make peace with the Arab world.

      Reagan, to his slight credit, rejected the nihilistic (only the powerful are special) position he espoused at election time, when Reagan made peace with the Soviets.

      Clinton encouraged the internet, and yes, Al Gore had a huge hand in the development of the internet.

      Note the missing family name–and that of a Warren Commission member.

    2. Hi Marcus:
      Indeed, who is giving the orders to Obama and Kerry, as they are the biggest mouth pieces in the US government. Seems like there is a cabal of “the secret government” issuing what to all is just “nutty” foreign policy orders. I am in no doubt, that within the military, senior members are also questioning such foreign policy matters, and in other words, the military is there to protect the US from foreign invaders, where there doesn’t seem to be any.

  2. Gail:

    May be the botched up quality of the intended false flag event (which still killed everyone on the plane) had the effect calling attention to much of the stupidities pursued by some in the west in Ukraine. No, I don’t mean the Russians really did it, and tried to pin it on the Ukrainians.

  3. Some Russians have no illusions that Ukraine is the first step to dismembering Russia, and that WWIII is unfolding:

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nWT5HM_NMlI
    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=x0zRD-Ulv2s

    Sergei Glazyev and Evgeny Federov are both allies of Putin. These discussions predate 17 July.

    Btw the “coincidence” of 17 July being the anniversary of the murder/execution of Tsar Nicholas II and of the explosion of TWA Flight 800 should make us, at least, entertain the possibility of an assassination attempt against Putin.

  4. IF ‘Third Force’ (e.g., Nazi Int’l) is behind MH17 shoot-down, then might Israel’s current ‘success’ in Gaza, be orchestrated by same group – with Israel winning all battles BUT losing ‘existential’ war?

    Israeli position re Gaza now supported by +/-90+% Israelis. Russian position re MH17 now supported by +/-80+% Russians. Kerry/ObamaCo-U.S. position re MH17 NOT supported by Americans – or by U.S. intel.

  5. A russian general has submitted records of a ukrainian mig 29 firing an rd 60 air to air missle at MH17 hitting the left engine(heat seeker),the plane banked hard to the left but regained control only to be hit by a secondary launch from the ground by a Kiev buk missle battery that finished the plane off. The records the russians have on this were sent to the U.N.dept investigating this incident and they are now waiting for america to submit its version(with proof) of what happened. Viewing this senario we can understand why Kiev is not eager to enforce their own ceasefire for investigators to begin to examine the wreakage. American politicians are now busy to eliminate the possibility of the russian proof reaching the western press. A real “who dun it”

    1. Where can I read these records?

      The SU 29 is a significantly different aircraft than the SU24 the Russians have claimed to have detected on radar. (F15 Eagle versus Warthog tank killer).

      And this is the first I read of Russians claiming the detection of missiles fired from a plane at MH17. Not like I ignore Russian claims either.

    2. And then there’s this angle. See the hi-res photo pdf before it too vanishes from the net.

      Revelations of German Pilot: Shocking Analysis of the “Shooting Down” of Malaysian MH17. “Aircraft Was Not Hit by a Missile”

      [A typical SU 25 jet is equipped with a double-barreled 30-mm gun, a 250 round magazine of anti-tank & splinter-explosive shells. The MH17 cockpit was fired at from both sides: entry & exit holes are found on the same fragment of it’s cockpit segment]

      – See more at: http://www.globalresearch.org/#sthash.wDhUOuAg.dpuf

      http://www.globalresearch.ca/german-pilot-speaks-out-shocking-analysis-of-the-shooting-down-of-malaysian-mh17/5394111

        1. And a SU25 doesn’t fly at 33,000 feet.

          So the claims about an Sukhoi 25’s cannon being used to shoot down the Boeing look to be a distraction.

  6. Well it is the Atlanticists who are positioning the use of nuclear weapons as another form of artillery.

    I have heard from credible sources seeking to warn the west that should Russia be so attacked….”we would launch everything”

    What this means is bye bye world….there would be more life on Mars!

    1. I more than suspect both sides have far more advanced, and useable, weapons than silly things like nuclear armed cannon shells.

  7. Neither Obama nor Merkel has any particular interest in fighting a war with Russia. So unlikely that Putin would have said to either: “I’ll release X.” Other parties in the US and Germany have fantasies about controlling central Europe and turning Russian lands into large mining towns.

    The Donald Cook thing just isn’t credible. And it’s so not credible that it detracts from even rumors about emp weapons or anti-radar shielding.

      1. JPF:

        The existence of such weapons is perfectly credible.

        But all of the Cook’s officers just resigning makes this particular tale less than credible in it’s entirety, so too the idea that the officers on such a ship wouldn’t be aware of at least the possibility of radar blinding weapons.

        Implicit in how the tale is told is the preposterous idea that no one in the US Navy had ever thought such a thing possible. “Preposterous” because those US warships carry phased array radar, and all of the weapons implied there.

        1. I agree with your assessment of the USS Donald Cook incident, but what exactly did happen, I don’t know. All I can ascertain is that it was Russian propaganda trying to paint the US warship and its crew as inept militarily and technologically challenged, which I just don’t buy into.

        2. Interesting takes Lost and Loisg… Russian propaganda it can certainly be. I am still of the opinion, however, that it was real and took them by surprise. For various reasons, I think the conventional military forces of this country have some “holes.” But anyway, a viable take nonetheless. Thanks!

          1. JPF:

            It’s the mass resignation thing that makes it ring entirely false.

            It’s probably not Russian propaganda, the story. (It may in fact be US propaganda. Dressed up to look like cold war propaganda or 1950s US mens mags describing fighting in the Pacific during World War Two.)

            Yes, various armed forces test the reaction of the other side all of the time. Including seeing how the other side reacts to very different weapons systems.

            The LAX air traffic control rumor seems much more likely.

    1. It is ridiculous to think that Obama does not want to fight a war with Russia, when it is precisely Obama who is pushing this war. If not he would have fired Victoria Nuland, Kerry, Hillary and the rest of the warmongers in his Administration.

      Yes Obama has to keep his left cover image to some degree, hence his initial reluctance to bomb Libya…but his masters forced him to because the covert war was not working.

      Color Revolution, drones, covert operations and just plain acts of murder are Obama’s preferred method.

      There is the psychological profile of Obama that makes him a perfect candidate for launching a first strike, which is exactly what he is setting up should other means fail for the
      Anglo-American-Zionist financial oligarchy.

      1. Gaia Mars-hall:

        Except it ridiculous to think that Obama can indeed fire all of the war mongers, some yes, but all is not how things work in the USA; there are factions.

        No, Obama is not the one pushing this confrontation with Russia.

      2. I’m with Lost on this one…Obama isn’t the warmonger in DC. Just listen to McCain and his allies and you’ll get a better indication of just who wants a war with Russia, if indeed anyone does.

        1. And if Obama were the one pushing a war in Ukraine against Russia, the current White House press briefings would resemble the Bush White House press briefings, circa the second half of 2002.

        2. I’m with both of ya. Consider this:

          Is Obama a POW “Prisoner of Washington”?

          This is the hypothesis: President Obama, taking office while America is drowning in debt, politically polarized and increasingly seen as a pariah nation, publicly dictated to and humiliated by the tiny state of Israel, at every turn, found himself imprisoned by the monstrosity he inherited.
          http://www.veteranstoday.com/2011/05/06/is-obama-a-pow-prisoner-of-washington/

          And this: Would a ‘warmonger’ give this kind of open and transparent interview?

          Uncensored: Obama’s Spiritual Beliefs
          In March of 2004, before Barack Obama became known to the world, Cathleen Falsani, the religion reporter for the respected Chicago Sun-Times newspaper, interviewed Obama about his religious beliefs and views. The interview presents an uncensored revealing of personal religious beliefs that few politicians have the courage to share.
          http://www.weboflove.org/inspiring_stories_08/081125_barack_obama_spiritual_beliefs_views

  8. I didn’t realize one could make the “Velvet Phone Call” a 3 way conference call. If indeed that is what may have occurred.

  9. If Putin has put FedGov.Inc in check, then will they start a war or other conflagration in the States, somewhere else or both? W/o war and chaos our beloved Gummint can’t function. They are as addicted to death and destruction as any heroin addict.

    1. The fact that the internet functions is vast evidence of a functioning federal government.

      Lumping the CIA/State Department driven coup in Ukraine in with every action of the Federal government doesn’t help stop the actual bad behavior by parts of the foreign policy establishment in the US.

  10. I think Putin said something along the lines of “You missed! You got the wrong plane! ”

    It must be a real soap opera in the background there. What with fake passports, decomposing bodies and Kiev frantically trying to bomb the crash site and get rid of all evidence. Fake youtube spliced videos, outdated google maps, fake satellite images posted on twitter, Yulia of the Nuke Russians fame tearing her plate out, Yets walking off stage left with his tail between his legs, the on going comedy skits with Psaki and Marie at the state department, Royal Dutch Shell suddenly pulling out of the fracking deal around Donesk for some unknown reason… and Ukie militia defecting left right and straight across the border into Russia for safety, … and the Kiev government in punch ups every second day…

    I spite of Paul Roberts warnings about WW3, we really do have the makings of a Hollywood block buster comedy here. Maybe we can pull Donald Sutherland out of the woodwork, and he can do that tank thing again to the tune of “Burning Bridges!”

    1. Just to add another short note. I am soooo glad I joined FB in 2010, even knowing it was a CIA spy vehicle. Man did I ever discover a new world and meet new people like Joseph. In spite of it being the worst of times, it really has been the best of times and given a choice, I would not have missed it for the world. Man I hope I live long enough because the movies are going to be great! And I will have some incredible stories to tell my grand children!

      1. “‘I think Putin said something along the lines of “You missed! You got the wrong plane!'”

        There’s not a lot of evidence that Putin’s plane was flying at the same time and also on the same rout from Amsterdam.

      2. Putin’s plane or not, makes for a good plot! The rest oh my word, a total botched up Flase FLag! We are all onto them now!

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