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RUSSIA, BRICSA, EU, AND NATO: PART TWO: TURKEY, CHINA, AND MISSILE ...

This story began in 2013, when Turkey's Defense Minister announced that that nation - a key member of the NATO alliance - was considering the purchase of a missile defense system.

The problem was, they weren't think of buying it from Marconi, Siemens, Rheinmetall, Bofors, Dassault, Olivetti, or Boeing or any other western seller. The were considering buying it from China:

Turkey Won't Rush Air Defense Contract

Now, you'll note that initially, Turkey's decision was clear and that Western contractors were not even in the running until pressure was brought against Ankara:

After a crucial meeting of Turkey's top procurement panel, the Defense Industry Executive Committee, Prime Minister Ahmet Davutoglu said Turkey would continue to negotiate with all three bidders in the disputed program.

In September 2013, Turkey selected China Precision Machinery Import-Export Corp. (CPMIEC) for a $3.44 billion offer. But after increased pressure from NATO allies, Ankara opened parallel talks with the second- and third-comers in the bidding — the European Eurosam, maker of the Aster 30, and the US Raytheon/Lockheed Martin, offering the Patriot system, respectively. Davutoglu said talks with all three bidders would cover an extended period of six months.

Turkey, as the article notes, has been using the contract to forestall American recognition of the Ottoman Empire's massacre of over a million Armenian Christians during the First World War. For the West, however, the matter is more pragmatic: if Turkey buys Chinese systems, this will impose a strain integrating those systems into the NATO defense architecture:

"The Turkish program consists of radar, launcher and interceptor missiles. It has been designed to counter enemy aircraft and missiles. Turkey has no long-range air defense systems.

"About half of Turkey's network-based air defense picture has been paid for by NATO. The country is part of NATO's Air Defense Ground Environment. Without NATO's consent, it will be impossible for Turkey to make the planned Chinese system operable with these assets, some analysts say.

"NATO and US officials have said any Chinese-built system could not be integrated with Turkey's joint air defense assets with NATO and the United States."

So what might really be going on here? Turkey remains immensely unpopular with Arab nations in the region, particularly in those nations that were once part of the Ottoman Empire. But Turkey also remains, in that region of the world, the most powerful of the Middle Eastern countries.  So why would Turkey even consider a militarily dubious move of buying a Chinese missile defense system, when its own defense experts had to have known of the looming compatibility issues with the rest of Turkey's NATO-standard equipment?

My high octane speculation is that the Turkish government, and Turks in general, are becoming increasingly dissatisfied with Washington's handling of the crises in Iraq, Syria, and Libya, a mishandling whith has seen the rise of radicalized groups, and which has destabilized the region on Turkey's doorstep. To put it differently, Turkey is now on the front line of the growing regional unrest, and as the major regional power, its interests have been ill-served, and  it may be, behind the public shows of support for NATO, that quietly, out of the light of the tv cameras, Turks are entertaining very different ideas, of a break in reliance upon NATO for its security. An arms deal with China might have been the first step toward defense standardization, not with NATO, but with the East.  So in my opinion, add Turkey to that list of "wobbly allies" after France, Germany, Italy, and so on.

For the moment, Turkey has decided to sit on any deals with China, and is looking again at the West. But for my money, don't expect that to last for very many years.

See you on the flip side...

21 thoughts on “ RUSSIA, BRICSA, EU, AND NATO: PART TWO: TURKEY, CHINA, AND MISSILE ...”

  1. @”Now, you’ll note that initially, Turkey’s decision was clear and that Western contractors were not even in the running until pressure was brought against Ankara”

    Last May, Turkey’s President Abdullah Gul cancelled a trip to Shanghai where the fourth CICA Summit(Conference on Interaction and Confidence-Building Measures in Asia) was hosted, because he had to travel to the scene of ‘one of the nation’s worst industrial disasters’ when a gas explosion in a mine in Zonguldak killed more than 200 people.

    Was it just a mere coincidence of events that such unfortunate disaster happened just before Gul’s trip to China? or was it a some kind of ‘message’ to the Turkish elites by someone?

    Another ‘coincidence’ is, Turkey happens to be holding the presidency of CICA but it was going to pass that to China during the Shanghai summit.

    In the main speech that president Xi jinping gave during the CICA summit, not only he reemphasized SCO’s ‘founding motto’, of the threat posed by “terrorism, separatism and extremism”, but calls for “zero tolerance” on the three problems and “deal it by going to the roots”.

    It seems Abdullah Gul was not the only leader that caught between attending an important meeting and dealing with a domestic ‘disaster’. Back in 2009, then Chinese president Hu jintao had to cancel his trip to Rome where G20 summit was held, because of ‘Urumqi unrest’.

    For years, Turkey played an ‘intricate role’ that is connected to the unrest to China’s Western autonomous region, one of the driving ideological cause is ‘Pan-Turanism’.
    Here is an indepth look at ‘Pan-Turanism’, written by an Iranian-Canadaian scholar it examines the potential threat posed by ‘Pan-Turanism’ to not only Iran, but also Russia and China.
    Its “similarity” to ‘Western’ racist ideologies such as Nazism, how the ‘West’ is “sympathetic” towards it and in fact how Rumsfeld and the Bush administration utilized it in their “anti-Iran” agenda.

    http://www.cais-soas.com/CAIS/Iran/pan_turkism_takes_aim_at_azarbaijan/part_vi.htm

    with that implication in mind, its worth to note that then vice president Xi jinping paid a visit to Turkey in 2012, while the trip was aimed at enhancing economic relations, there was another important agenda,
    “”We hope that stability and normal order will be restored in relevant countries in the region as soon as possible,” Xi told Turkish President Abdullah Gul, referring to West Asia and north Africa but without naming individual countries, according to state news agency Xinhua.

    He added that Beijing was willing to make “unremitting efforts” to promote peace in the region but stressed that it “supports” countries’ efforts to deal with “their domestic affairs independently.””

    2012 saw the unveiling of “Syria crisis” in which Turkey also played an ‘intricate role’, and ‘ISIL’ is spreading precisely to regions where the Russians and the Chinese would be concerned. For instance, the Kremlin is talking up “ISIL threat” in “Central Asia” since the begining of this year and it has just announced to provide assistance to Tajikistan to ‘combat ISIL threat”. Not to mention, in an unprecedented and surprise move last year, China offered Iraqi government ‘military assistance’ against ‘ISIL’.

    For “terrorism, separatism and extremism” threaten Putin’s ‘Eurasian Economic Union’, threaten China’s “New Silk Road”, they go through regions and countries where “Pan-Turanism” could become a source of instability. Then its no surprise, both the Russians and the Chinese have recently reached out to Ankara.

    Arguably, the Chinese are trying to influence the Turkish elites by economic means, but also by military means with their intention of selling missiles to Turkey. (silimar with what China does with Argentina, economic engagement followed by military hardware sales, and isnt it quite interesting that both Argentina and Turkey have had “Nazi-connections”?)
    Whether this attempt would be successful or not remains to be seen, since there are indicators that Turkey is under intense pressure from the ‘West’ not to buy Chinese missile system, but there are other indicators to suggest Turkey is still caught between different camps and its still wavering, given Turkey also applied to become a founding member of AIIB, which would be focusing on building infrastructure across ‘Asia’ that complements the “New Silk Road” initiative.

    Given there were the 2004 Madrid train bombings, followed by 2005 London bombings, then there was last year’s Kunming Railway Station ‘terrorist attack’ by Uigur ‘extremists’, its not hard to picture the Russians and the Chinese might be worried about the newly built high-speed train linking Beijing-Moscow blown up somewhere along the line by people with ‘ideological connection’ to Ankara which also somehow serves “Western interests”.

    Perhaps reaching out to Turkey is part of Xi’s “deal it by going to the roots” strategy, afterall it was him who paid a visit to Ankara back in 2012.

    1. “According to the legend, it was this Grey Wolf that awakened the Turks to their legacy of conquest and civilization building”

      “Grey Wolf activists use the hand to mimic the head of that mythical Grey Wolf”

      http://www.cais-soas.com/CAIS/Images2/Misc/kaveh_farrokh/pan-tu12.gif

      I was just watching the British tv series “Utopia” yesterday, its interesting that ‘the Western elites’ who wanted to “genocide” 90-95% of humanity actually praise Genghis Khan as some kind of ‘predecessor’..

      Similar to the ‘Turkish’ legend, the Mongolians were also allegedly guided by a ‘wolf’, ‘awakening’ them to ‘world conquest’. In other words, onto the path of ‘mass murder’ or shall we call it ‘mass human sacrifice’?

      I also learned from watching “Ancient Aliens” series few years ago, that one of the notorious serial killers in America actually claimed that he had received “his instruction”(to kill people) from a dog. That according to some lore is the sign of ‘the devil’ meddling with humans..

      Like the Aztec king Montezuma received his “instruction” from Huitzilopochtli, the Aztec deity of War and human sacrifice to enslave and murder people around, as well as the Spanish Conquistador Cortez who received his “instruction” from “god” to slaughter native populace..

      So,what are the odds that this ‘Pan-Turanism’ group ‘Grey Wolf’ happens to have a hand sign that is the same as alleged hand sign for “devil-worshipping”? Like the hand signs the Bushes did? and the bush administration happens to work with this group to achieve their “Iran agenda”? Too much “coincidences”.

      Pardon me for my ‘obsession’ with “the devil”, afterall i once had a dream in which i was kicking his minions asses with the guidance of an elderly Taoist monk, i think thats somehow connected to my ‘past live’.. so the interests is kind of “personal”..

  2. Turkey appears to have a geopolitical/cultural problem analogous to that of Germany. Turkey used to be a preeminent imperial power (the Ottomans explicitly claimed to be the heirs to Rome) that now identifies with one particular brand of Islam–espoused by the Muslim Brotherhood–and which Ottomans, in the day, stormed Vienna (2x actually) thinking it would literally take Europe by storm. Lately, it has battered ineffectively on the EU door again seeking entree to that market and finds that it backed the loser (the Muslim Brotherhood) in Egypt and has failed so far to fulfill the resurrection of its hegemony in the Middle East by bringing down Assad in Syria and reining in the Kurds.

    Now the Russians are offering natural gas a la “Turk Stream,” the Iranians and the Indians are bartering gold for Iranian energy via Turkish entities, circumventing the sanctions on direct trade with Iran and the Shanghai Cooperative Organization is open to Turkish membership.

    This leaves the Turks with their geoploitical/cultural anchor dragging, similar to that experienced by the Germans. Neither seems to be able get what they want from the west and can’t resurrect their imperial legacy under the present global configuration. A decision by either to abandon the Atlanticist/NATO cabal for parts east is enough to keep all their politicians up at night wondering what world they will find themselves in if they make the leap to hypereast, so to speak. Their respective industrialists, money worshipers as they are, have fewer qualms and doubts about where their interests lie.

    Stay tuned, as this is gonna be a real whopper of a story.

  3. Turkey is the elephant in the room in the middle east, it’s location is one reason, and the other is it’s a member of NATO. I mean they did that pipeline deal with Russia, and the EU paid the penalty of losing that pipeline which was to end up in Europe. So what if they buy Chinese missiles, don’t they have the right to buy whatever they like?
    Well it seems they don’t, and NATO is going to make dame sure that they make the “right” decision. Seems like sovereignty doesn’t cut it in today’s world of being on the right side.

  4. The story of the Turkish Republic:

    Republic is born – tries to stay neutral all the time and totally away from the middle east. Ataturk dies in 1938, we successfully avoid WW2.

    Then something happens : the atom bomb! Our statesmen and generals are shocked! The last war they had seen was WW1 when machinegun was the highest technological achievement.

    1948 – Stalin kindy asks our eastern provinces and the control of the Bosphorus Straits.

    Our guys run to the waiting arms of the west – send soldiers to Korea in 1952, fight like maniacs, have many soldiers sacrificed and voila we are in NATO!

    Complete trust to the west – go along with everything they say.

    The west decides we need to be part of the “Green Belt” – an Islamic youth needs to be raised and islamic politicians must take center stage so as to protect us from communism.

    Erbakan and then after him Erdogan are created along with their alternative Islamic “deep organization – deep state” Fethullah Gulen.

    Erdogan gets too powerful – starts to see dreams of Grandeur – fucks up big time in the Middle East – meddles with Syria – ends up with 3 million Syrian refugees who decide that Turkey is better than Syria and they shall not leave even if there’s peace in Syria.

    Kurds come up with PKK – a terrorist organization that is heavily assisted by western intelligence agencies – Kurds declare their love for Obama.

    The remaining few million Turks actually want their own little province away from Kurds – Arabs – whatever….

  5. Long story short:

    Ottoman Empire is born from a Turkish tribe – the Oguz – Kayi.

    They marry almost exclusively to western women. There are almot no Turkish wives to the Ottoman Rulers.

    The Turkish identity is lost.

    All other ethnicities within the Empire keep their idenitities. Bulgarians do not forget they are Bulgarians, Greeks being Greeks, Armenians being Armenians, Arabs being Arabs etc.

    Armenians are actually the favored ethnicity. They are the traders and craftsmen. Exempt from military service.

    Turk who have forgotten their identities are used as cannn fodder for the empire. The Empire looks to the west and cares nothing about the eastern provinces.

    Empire loses power, western provinces start rebelling starting with Greeks, Bulgarians etc.

    4-5 million Turks are slaughtered in the Balkans. World does not notice.

    Young Turks are formed – The Empire realises destroying its own ethnicity was the biggest mistake.

    1st World War begins.

    Russians attack from the east.

    Armenians in east anatolia rebel, take arms and aid the Russian Army with weapons suplied by the Russian Army.

    Armenian rebels start mass slaughter of Turkish villagers – most men are fighting in WW1 and the women and children are defenseless. Horror stories abound; rape and burning villagers alive and what not.

    Armenians in east anatolia are forced to migrate west so the slaughter can stop. Kurds happily assist in the robbing and killing of Armenians on the road. ( Who knew they would be best buddies later on? )

    Ottoman Empire was one big fuckup is my idea. We Turks lost our identity. We died on the battlefield forever to feed a fat mongrel family of rulers.

  6. Hi, hailing from Turkey – the deal with the Air defence system is mostly about transfer of know how. Quite simply, western producers do not want to give you the source codes, threat library etc. So we go to whoever would supply that, even the system capabilities maybe less than those of its western rivals.

    We have problem with the locally developed cruise missiles, gps guided bombs, laser guided bombs too – integrating them onto the F-16 requires approval and access codes so to say from Lockheed Martin and the US Congress.

    1. Welcome Erdem,
      I served with Turks on the DMZ in Korea 55 or so years ago and had a lot of respect for their professionalism and courtesy. I agree, its probably the current leaders in Turkey involved in Syria. If only governments and religions would get out of the way, we would have a much more peaceful world. Maybe…
      db

  7. I’m confused. Considering the US is run by psychopaths, is the potential recognition of the Armenian genocide by the Turks meant to be an honor? And considering the Turks are run by psychopaths, are they miffed because the US refuses to bestow upon them this long overdue tribute? Maybe there is some contention between these dueling psychopaths over the Kurdish “problem.” Possibly the Turks are dragging their feet on committing mass genocide against them or, more likely, there is some dispute over who will get the Kurdish land once all of its occupants have been exterminated? The Turks would naturally want all of it, but I would wager the zionists believe a good chunk of it should go towards greater Israel. Then there are the western intelligence services who would argue that they softened up the Kurds for culling with their ISIS mercenaries and therefore, they should, in the least, get the oil, gas and poppy fields.

    My high octane speculation is this: by selecting this Wal Mart grade missile defense system made by the Chinese, the Turks, or should I say the men behind the curtain, those cosmic war refugees we fondly call the banksters, are hoping to leave Gobeki Tepe virtually defenseless and thereby ripe for “errant” missile attack. This would leave that inconvenient testament to our true past buried for another 10,000 years. I imagine when the time comes, ISIS will get their hands on just the the missiles to penetrate Turkish defenses. Or better yet, why not launch a missile barrage from a US naval ship and blame the destruction on this world heritage site on that Syrian villain Assad?

    Off topic, but I recently learned that Olympic gold medalist Bruce Jenner had a sex change and is also the stepfather of the Kardashians. That is certainly stranger than anything I have ever read on Giza Death Star. (I don’t have a television).

    1. Frankie I was remote viewing a mass suicide at a computer chip factory recently, seems the mib were called in, not the usual assembly worker but high management jumpers joining in… the details were a bit foggy…any thing on your end?

      1. Jedi,

        I’ve been remote viewing the Haydron collider and we are all in deep doggy doo. The scientists have become so bombarded with “god” particles that they are on the equivalent of a permanent ayahuasca trip and so now Legion has been able to wrest control of the collider and is building his own universe… using our universe as building material! If you have noticed yourself getting lighter, it is because we are all hemorrhaging particles. They are being sucked into the black hole Legion in creating under CERN. And beware, if you try to remote view it, it is like being stuck inside a pinball machine. Particles are flying everywhere! And don’t try to reason with Legion. He has become maniacal. He thinks he is Brahma, Vishnu and Shiva all rolled into one– creating and sustaining a universe while destroying one as well. I’ve been trying to teach him how to meditate, but he has trouble focusing on one thing because currently he has billions, if not trillions of thoughts going through his circuitry at one time. I tell you– we are in a lot of trouble. We will probably have to resume this discussion in the next universe after we have been reassembled. That unfortunately could take billions of years, or a day in the life of Brahma as Legion likes to joke. I hope all is well otherwise.

  8. But Turkey is a creation of the West due the stab in the back of the Orthodox Christians. The destruction of the Eastern Roman Empire, Crusades disaster liquidation of the East Asian Christianity with the nuking of Nagasaki in five months we will be celebrating the seventieth anniversary of that genocide this year . Armenian genocide who among our elites really care what are their religious beliefs anyway I don’t even think Satan would want to associated with these degenerates either.

    1. The A bomb dropped on Nagasaki wasn’t an act of genocide, even if it happened to kill Japanese who were christian.

      Killing christians en mass isn’t killing a geno.

      1. What if the plan was to destroy the possibility of Christianity reviving in Asia. Reversing Islam hold in that area of the World Lost has that idea not cross your mind. Japan besides Korea and Philippines had the largest Roman Catholic-Christian populations in Asia.

  9. My thoughts now concern, why did the West genocide the Armenian Christians and what ancient sites in Turkey have the West been eyeing/messing with? Something tells me Turkey has seen the archeological/cosmological pattern that courses behind the West’s Middle Eastern policies and it has them worried their country is next on the list. Shades of the Albigensian Crusade much?

    1. knowledge is known as wealth, treasure…kicking the money changers out of the temple takes on a new meaning. Temple being of course above your eyes, ie your mind.
      in revelations, it is written that you thought you are poor yet you are rich….2.9 and 3.9.
      …interesting the article about light activated genes.

    1. I’d say the current government is deeply tied to the “instability in Syria”. Current government defines itself as being Sunni Muslim and actually do not like the idea of Turkish Nationalism. Erdogan is proud to be of Georgian origin with a wife of Arabic origin ( he declared himself – to show that he’s not a Turk – Nationalist ).

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